And that goes for EVERYTHING

by Marti Fischer


Grief has hit our home hard. A dear friend of Chandler’s has taken his life.

Ethan Vinograd was a sensitive young man who was loved by his Mom and Dad, his sisters and twin brother.

Here are his last words written 4 days before his birthday, which is today.  He writes to all of us: “When you forgive those who have hurt you, you are forgiving yourself. EVERYONE, and I mean EVERYONE, will be fighting battles they do not discuss. Allow yourself to be the gift of compassion and empathy. No ‘side’ can be victorious unless all ‘sides’ are. And that goes for EVERYTHING.”

As ministers to the Millennial generation, we support Ethan when he said to ALL of us — what we ALL need to hear and take to HEART.

The millennial generation, over 75 million strong, is America’s largest generation — eclipsing the current size of the postwar baby boom generation. Millennials make up nearly a quarter of the total U.S. population, 30 percent of the voting age population, and almost two-fifths of the working age population.

Most notably, the millennial generation, now 44 percent minority, is the most diverse adult generation in American history. While its lasting legacy is yet to be determined, this generation is set to serve as a social, economic, and political bridge to chronologically successive (and increasingly racially diverse) generations. Given this snap shot, they are over 75 million people full of anxiety and suffering from depression and loneliness.

Millennials are anxious and you would be too if you lived on the Internet and viewed issues from a global perspective. They see world hunger, climate change worldwide, and they understand that the next World War will be over water and not oil.

And they have a tendency toward depression.  Why? The answer is rather obvious. They are entering a battle where they perceive few happy stories. And they are lonely. Why? The Millennial generation is the first generation that did not require an older, wiser person — be it Daddy, Grandpa, or a Pastor — because if they have a question, “they just google it.”

What Millennials need is more than what we are willing to do.

They need a trusted relationship and not a quick cup of coffee at Starbucks sprinkled with Jesus. To be trusted requires investing time in the person versus an invitation to church and a few introductions. To give time is to build trust. They need us to listen. They will not be vulnerable to us unless we are vulnerable to them, as sinners, like everyone else on this planet. They will not respect us and consider what we offer, unless we respect them and consider what they have to offer us.

Some will say… who cares?  Let them care for themselves. We earned this chance to rest in our comfy chairs. But our question, and maybe Ethans, if he was here, is, “Do you really want to pull yourself out of the game? Are you really done?”

The Millennials are walking toward a new frontier — unprepared.  This should be extremely upsetting to us for a multiple of reasons, beginning with the fact that they are more similar to us than different. Many of us were witnesses to or were influenced by the Jesus Movement. Someone stood for us.  Someone made sure we were armed with the word of God. Someone didn’t wait for us to clean up our act.  Someone loved us in the mess of our life … and they stayed. Someone was to each of us a proven and trusted relationship.

The Millennials are anxious for a multitude of reasons. They know they are not equipped. But they know they will not allow someone to come alongside them who is not transparent. Who does the Millennial relate to who will be transparent?  There’s the negative direction of it — what is it, 90% of the Millennials, including mainstream evangelical ones say the church is completely discredited, particularly that it is judgmental. Where is the next generation of believers going to come from if they are all alienated from it now?

Let’s face it, this is not the Great Awakening nor is it the Jesus Movement. But it is a call for relationships with a generation that has every reason not to trust us.  Relationships take time. They grow. They can enhance each other. They are there for one another in a time of need.  And they celebrate each other. They are thankful each was born.

But more importantly — those who witnessed the Jesus Movement know the Holy Spirit, regardless if that relationship went dormant.

At this point, the Millennials are walking into a new frontier. It is a global frontier. It is a dangerous time for these new pioneers and they know it. Who do they have to walk with them toward this new frontier if not you?

May dear Ethan rest in peace as we end this Catch as we began it:

“When you forgive those who have hurt you, you are forgiving yourself. EVERYONE, and I mean EVERYONE, will be fighting battles they do not discuss. Allow yourself to be the gift of compassion and empathy. No ‘side’ can be victorious unless all ‘sides’ are.  And that goes for EVERYTHING.”

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20 Responses to And that goes for EVERYTHING

  1. TOM F> says:

    I feel led to comment. I feel like I”m grieving the loss of a brother I’ve never met.I have been on an emotional roller coaster the last few weeks. I have been remembering what life was like for me in my teens and early twenties. I compared my insides to everyone else’s outsides. I felt like maybe I was absent the day they passed out the magic instruction book for living a happy life. Even though I went to church on Sunday and attended Christian schools from third grade threw college. I still turned to alcohol and other drugs to keep from caring so much about what others might think of me and what I thought about myself. In my second year of college I found some fellowship in informal bible studies and atended concerts of people- Keith Green, Randy Stonehill , etc. I sobered up for a couple years but relapsed after getting away from all that fellowship. seven years later I ended up in AA with nudge from the judge. I ended up picking a Christian sponsor After hearing me share at a meeting a women approached me and suggested I read a book written by John Fisher 30 something years later l have learned the importance of being transparent. I prayed for while for God to help me see others the way He does. And I began to see the value in everyone I meet. And looking back through times of self examination I can clearly see that Jesus has been relentlessly persuing a relationship with me my entire life. Recovery people tell their story Christ Followers share their testimony both are the practice of gut level honesty. THEY WILL KNOW WE ARE CHRISTIANS BY OUR LOVE. The most loving thing is to let a person know that they are not alone and not the only one

    • Mark D Seguin says:

      Dear Tom F, may I please suggest to seriously consider looking into Dr. Shad Helmstetter self talk Ministry…. He has a website: Shad Helmstetter – self talk

      God’s speed & love to you…

    • jwfisch says:

      Thank you, Tom, for telling your story. The most telling thing is how much you were suffering and no one knew. The most telling part about Ethan’s short writing is: “Everyone will be fighting battles they do not discuss.” Apparently Ethan had no place to go where he could be honest. That’s why discipleship is all about relationships. It’s only in developing honest relationships can people be really helped. Jesus can save someone’s soul for eternity; we might be able to save their life.

      • Mark Dennis Seguin says:

        Amen Pastor John to this: “Jesus can save someone’s soul for eternity; we might be able to save their life.” The power of love and caring!

        A thought came to mind back when I first learned of the story of Cain & Abel and the question was asked to God am I, my brothers keeper – and although many times I would much rather not be, yet I know to be more like Jesus I am y brother’s keeper!

        PS Also I once had a very dear sweet Pastor @ a Church called Faith Baptist in Dearborn, MI and Pastor Gregory once shared a peril of wisdom w/ me and said Mark do you want to know how God will help you with problems? Help others with their!

  2. Mark Seguin says:

    Wow! I’m stunned and very sad for Ethan (RIP my brother!) his family & Chandler… My nephew Kyle took hi life years ago and left my youngest & so dear sister Marsha & Kurt (he husband) changed forever!

    They joined a group here in Michigan & do believe it’s Nation wide “Out of the Darkness” maybe, just maybe consider Pastor John & Marti to suggest it to Ethan family – it GREATILY helped Kurt & Marsha b/c it gave them access to other parents that had loss a child by taken their life….

    God’s speed…

    PS All the time I was reading this the saying i learned in my Amway Biz people don’t care how much you know, until they know how much you care.

    • jwfisch says:

      Mark: Thanks for this suggestion. We don’t know the parents but are trying to get a hold of them. If we do, we will suggest that organization.

  3. Tim Callaway says:

    Peace to all concerned as you once again experience what it means to be living with unanswered questions.

  4. Toni Petrella says:

    To the Catch Ministry and beyond. So sorry to hear about Chandler’s friend Ethan. So true about depression among the millenials. I know what it is to have someone in the family lost their life that way. My Dad back in September of 1991 months after I came back from Desert Shield Desert Storm in the Gulf. He had a breakdown the year before. He served twenty years in the Air Force. He expected so much perfection of himself and anyone around him. Eventually this got him and on a Sunday in September 1991 he took his life with his pistol and Mom found him in the garage on the step in front of the door leading to the inside of the house. Mom had come back from church. Now is a time for all of us together to Follow Jesus and I mean have that faith and be understanding towards all. Take care, God Bless, and prayers are with you all.

  5. Even though there is a timeline that separates generations, there is a Lifeline that remains the same today as it was yesterday and will be tomorrow.

    And while the delivery systems for todays varying levels of angst (hell) may be swifter and seem more dauntingly coercive, the emotions, struggles, and methods of dealing with depression, rejection, paranoia, and hopelessness are no different than when the Boomers were the new kids on the block and todays Mils/Gens.
    In fact, our parents and their parents before them (and their parents before them, etc.) suffered the same assaults on their senses of purpose, value, well-being, and questions like “What’s it all about?” or “Is this all there is?” or “Is my life worth living?”.
    Those seeking illumination, truth, peace, contentment, satisfying answers to life’s mysteries, and reasons behind mankind’s lunacies are exactly the same now as at any other time in history.

    If one leans toward believing the Biblical Scriptures or other texts thought to be divinely-inspired then one must conclude that the search for any kind of personal meaning is designed to be an intentional internal inclination.
    One of life’s many big challenges is whether we’ll choose to see that pursuit through to the end, chase something else, give up… or stop altogether.

    Still, it’s no less tragic when a young one – or anyone – chooses suicide as their best solution for (or escape from) the mess we’ve all contributed to in this old world whether by our sinful actions, selfish inactions, lack of care, and/or thoughtlessness.

    There was an obituary written in the Los Angeles Times earlier this week about Linda Kasabian (73), a cult member of the Charles Manson “family.”
    The article stated:
    In 1969, 20-year-old Linda Kasabian came to California to find God. Instead, she found Charles Manson…
    Like many of the era’s youthful seekers, Kasabian drifted around the country taking drugs, living in communes and practicing free love.
    “I was like a little blind girl in the forest,” Kasabian said, “and I took the first path that came to me.”
    ~ Los Angeles Times – 02-28-2023

    Are things really that radically different in the human soul and the search for acceptance or hope between then and today? I think not.

    As mentioned at the top, there is a Lifeline.
    And we, EVERYONE of us – Mr., Mrs., Miss and gender-neutral Boomer – are a part of that Lifeline.
    Whether they’re floundering in waters of despair or blindly wandering down a path toward tragedy, if you or I are aware of their predicament then you and I are charged with the responsibility of casting that Lifeline to that individual – whether young or old – and helping that “little blind” child find the right path on the Way to the Truth and the Life.
    To decline that responsibility is a sin.

    A final thought:
    While decades and epidermal layers are the most obvious differences, the chasm between yesterdays young adults and todays young adults isn’t really as deep or wide as many people would either imply or even desire.
    Experience and empathy (if we choose to feel and express it) are the Boomers’ main advantages.
    More years, energy , a wide open frontier of knowledge and experiences are the advantages set in front of the young.
    Yet, guileless hopes and belief in better tomorrows are within the purview of every generation, regardless of age or history.
    And there lies just one of the many similarities between Booms, Mils, and Gens.

    My condolences and prayers for comfort go to the Vinograd family, Chandler, friends, and loved ones.

    Shalom, Peace….

    • Mark D Seguin says:

      Again my brother Bob thoroughly enjoyed reading your comments!

      You’re a blessing to me my Catch buddy & friend!
      God’s speed & many blessings to you & yours…

  6. Peter Leenheer says:

    So s9rry to read about Chandler’s best friend. my condolences and God’s comfort to all family members , friends and acquaintances. Anytime someone dies of natural causes it is tragic. Suicide is even more tragic. Often the individuals that do it are not loved the way God intended them to be loved. This lack of love is depressing to all, but the reaction to it is always a destructive behavior of some sort.

    Destructive behavior is a red flag that needs attention. it is a good habit to be discerning about people who are depressed and to help comfort them in any way you can. This discernment requires a very concerted effort on the helper.

    My wife has dementia in the latter stages. As a result she is depressed. She requires daily comfort via holding her hand and sitting with her for hours. I talk to her about heaven, JEsus and how much love God has for her by granting free grace and salvation. This gives her comfort. She grieves daily for the loss of her memory, loss of ability to do what she once did and loss of her identity. She prays to God to release her from this misery. I pray to God that HE will help her endure it. Glad my prayer appears to be answered.

    In the earlier part of our marriage she and I went for counselling and I found out that she had been suicidal for most of her life due to physical and mental abuse. I had no clue about any of that till then and I thought that I was discerning about depression.

    It is now up to me to love her the way God wants me to love her. So I live as a sane person with one whose confused mind affects everything in the house. I do not criticize, accuse or condemn her for anything. Her anxiety is high when she can’t find something so I stop everything and help her find it. Constant prayer has helped me ALWAYS find what she thinks she lost.

    This type of love is a huge sacrifice. I do it willingly. She thanks me daily. I say that I am very glad that I can love her as God intended. We have been married 49 years and finally in the last three of these I am loving as God intended. it was late in coming but man does it feel good to be obedient. I repent for all the other 46 years when that was not the case.

    So let us get out there and love and comfort anyone and everyone in our circle of family, friends and community. Study the signs of depression and reach out with the love of Christ.

    To all other commenters…it is good to see us all come at this in a different direction.
    It is good to see that when we notice what breaks God’s heart it also breaks ours and we reach out like He does in LOVE.

    • Mark Dennis Seguin says:

      My brother Peter I’m so sorry to learn about your wife, yet may I please say I am thoroughly impressed with you!

      God’s speed & you & your wife are in my thoughts & prayers….

    • Peter, thank you very much for your comments.
      You don’t know how deeply inspirational and eye-opening they are for me right now.

      My wife, Paula, is in the middle stages of Dementia and we, too, struggle with most everything you’ve described.
      It started with cognitive decline, then her gait, and so forth.
      A month ago, Paula fell and broke her right arm.
      Two weeks ago, she fell and sprained her right ankle.
      She looks like a half-wrapped mummy!
      But, all in all, she’s still in good spirits.

      While the inevitable outcome is certain, each day – each hour – has an element of uncertainty that certainly tests my patience, faith, and even love.
      I’ve been frustrated by the prognosis of hopelessness; unanswerable questions; and unanswered prayers.
      The fact that there is no medical cure is incomprehensible to me. I scream, “Why isn’t this fixable??!!”

      Your words above, Peter, challenge and encourage me to take my love for Paula to a deeper, different level – a level that, during our 42-years of marriage, I can’t honestly say I’ve seriously delved into before.

      The regret, the repentance, and the determination you expressed to love your wife as God intended makes clearer to me the place where I am at currently and the steps I must take to express that same Love to my dear, lovely, dying wife.

      Thank you, Peter, Shalom,..
      …and prayers for Peace and comfort to you and Mrs. Leenheer.

      • Mark Seguin says:

        Let me plz express both of you gentlemen I’m GREATLY impressed w/ your deep love and caring for your wives!

        God’s speed to you both and you all…

        PS I deeply wish I could do more than jus offer my love & prayers!

      • says:

        Thank you, Bob. It was emotional for me to read what you are going through. As a result, It has taken some time for me to respond. Thank you very much for taking the time to tell me, that what I said helped your situation with a “disappearing wife”. That is how I see Jane today, like someone having terminal cancer and literally disappearing right in front of me.

        I am no saint. I too am and have been frustrated beyond belief. Nothing is where it used to be. So, it is a constant search for cutlery, pans, cook ware etc. She disagrees with me, and has out of this world opinions that make no sense. She always did everything. She was a ‘super wife’, and I was not allowed to help. Now, I have to do everything and that doesn’t work. So, I Prioritize. Some days it seems like I apologize constantly. I get angry at times at the situation….her mind is mostly gone, and mine isn’t, but my body needs a new knee, is filled with osteoarthritis, and have atrial fibrulation but Jane’s body has virtually no issues. So we are one but actually two people. Dressing myself is now a major event because of lack of flexibility and arthritis. As you can surmise from this I too have screamed at first. Today was a bad day for us. So I sat in the Television room and watched a Hallmark movie. The tear jerkers, they help me cry. It is better to cry than be angry. The last three years my tears make Niagara Falls look like a trickle. We both realize that we are constantly mourning.

        Man, I can hardly wait to go to heaven!!!

        A woman’s house is her nest. Jane does not want to leave it. So we stay. This required adamant sticking to my guns because family members disagree. My take is not to take the trauma of dementia and double that trauma by moving to an old age home. We have access to help from Alberta Health Services for help to do the hygiene items. So we stay in our home until we have to leave because of total lack of taking care of our selves.

        The phrase that keeps coming to my mind is , ‘The time is not yet right’. Jesus said my time has not yet come. So I am following that. To be sure I check with God and health care professionals so that I am aware of when the time is right. My kids and relatives think I am procrastinating. Waiting for God can seem like that. They respect my opinion and after discussion have learned to see the wisdom in God’s ways.

        It seems to me old age is God’s way of showing us how much we need Him. Avoid asking Him “Why”, because that question does not get answered. The trick is to go through the storm, not to question why you are in it.

      • Mark Dennis Seguin says:

        My brother Peter let me please suggest a product that may help you:

        Consider going to my website: and in the Search box type in 300325 and that should take to you see a very good & helpful product: (An Orange Color) XS™ CBD Pro Cream Samples and I fell so many times in the shower this stuff GREATILY HELPED me! And hopefully it helps you w/ your osteoporosis in helping make it easier for you to get dressed.

        Now let mew please offer you this bit of logic:
        1) say you try it and it doesn’t work. That’s no problem B/C Amway offers a 100% satisfaction guarantee, so you win – b/c you tried it, yet didn’t work, so get your money back. So you win….
        2) say you try it and sure enough it does as it’s guaranteed to do… So you win!

        Either way you WIN!

        Please feel free to call Amway customer service 1-800 253-6500 and tell them your considering become a customer of Mark Seguin Biz Owner #1924041

        God’s speed to you & Jane!

    • jwfisch says:

      Thanks you Peter for sharing your story. It is full of truth for all of us.

  7. Peter Leenheer says:

    Two things:
    1. Mark, thank you for your kind and sympathetic words. They and the prayers are appreciated. The most helpful thing you can do is pray for both Bob, Paula, Jane and Peter, because prayer is one of God’s offensive weapons.
    2. Bob, part of my comment did not come through. So here goes…Thank you for your thoughtful responses over the years. I have thought of unsubscribing. As a 78 year old guy who loves God I just want to be a blessing. Thanks for letting me bless you and for you and Mark to bless me back.
    My prayers for you and Paula go up as I type this.

    Love to all at the Catch.

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